What part of programming challenges you the most?

I'm not sure where this should go, couldn't find a relative forum.

I'd be interested to hear, what do you hate working with in php?

Could even be a general programming 'thing'. For example, mine would have to be timezone issues (like DST etc).

Inheriting bad code from someone else and having to maintain it   Not really a php specific gripe I suppose..  My biggest php complaint would be its extortionate memory usage.

This topic should probably go in general discussion, I'll report it and see where the mods move it..

Thanks! I wasn't sure where it should go.

Yep, I hate maintaining bad code. Memory usage ey? Thanks, that's exactly what I'm looking for.

There's a wealth of complaints by me about php memory usage here: http://btherl.livejournal.com/?tag=programming

Along with some other php and postgres complaints.  With postgres it's mainly the braindead query plans it comes up with sometimes, and the total lack of ability to override them.

Still on the topic of memory usage, it would be nice if php had a native array type which acted like a C or Perl array, and didn't store all the indexes as zvals.  It's such a waste.

Oh I just remembered my other complaint - php does not have lexical or file scoped setting of warnings, and some of the warnings it gives are just plain annoying.  I don't want to have to check if an array index exists before accessing it - I should be able to easily switch this off while maintaining other warnings which are actually useful, particularly reading from a variable which hasn't been set to any value.

Perl does this much better.

Thanks for input btherl.

What about tasks or areas of programming you dread? Rather than bad things - what about challenges?

I've changed the title to account for that. I wasn't too clear in my original title.

If a mod sees this could you repost with my new title?

If a mod sees this could you repost with my new title?

I've changed your original title.

If a mod sees this could you repost with my new title?

 

I've changed your original title.

Thanks! Appreciate it.

Implementing business rules. You know how it goes. You take the process description from a client, and design a clean and streamlined work process. Then they look at it and add in heaps of exceptional situations that wreak havoc around your code, force you to do ugly things (hardcoding values anyone?) and make you feel dirty at the end of the day.

Implementing business rules. You know how it goes. You take the process description from a client, and design a clean and streamlined work process. Then they look at it and add in heaps of exceptional situations that wreak havoc around your code, force you to do ugly things (hardcoding values anyone?) and make you feel dirty at the end of the day.

 

Amen. And the damn thing ends up being unusable and barely readable by even yourself. One of the worst ones I had was implementing VAT (tax) rules into an eccomerce app. The client had so many different rules for adding tax to prices, i.e products belong to different tax groups, if you buy a product from tax group A and 2 products from tax group B then tax is calculated using formula X, but if you buy 1 product from tax group B then tax is calculated using formula Y, and then if a customer has completed an exempt form no tax is added unless they are purchasing a product from group C. It was one hell of a job to implement and make it so that the client could add tax groups and rules that apply. I just dread looking at it if something goes wrong.

Implementing business rules. You know how it goes. You take the process description from a client, and design a clean and streamlined work process. Then they look at it and add in heaps of exceptional situations that wreak havoc around your code, force you to do ugly things (hardcoding values anyone?) and make you feel dirty at the end of the day.

Yep! Happens too many times and no matter how abstract my code may be (which is another challenge of mine), I find myself having to completely change the structure of it.

..and neil, that sound like a nightmare!

Implementing business rules. You know how it goes. You take the process description from a client, and design a clean and streamlined work process. Then they look at it and add in heaps of exceptional situations that wreak havoc around your code, force you to do ugly things (hardcoding values anyone?) and make you feel dirty at the end of the day.

 

Hardest thing about coding for me is dealing with other web devs.  Best case scenario is they are good but have their own style of doing things..which is mostly okay, as long as they know wtf they are doing.  Worst case scenario (which I should really call average case scenario) is they have no business being a web developer in the first place...client too stingy to put real money into that sort of resource so I'm stuck dealing with c/p cowboys.

As a freelancer, I hate dealing with clients.  Living in rural New England, most other small business owners are a frustrating mix of cheap, ignorant, and stubborn.  Not fun to deal with at all.

I'm actually happy I've found some success as a subcontractor.  Doing work for people who at least have some idea of various parts of development is much more rewarding, especially if they've dabbled in PHP before.  They know enough to not want to touch what you write.

Implementing business rules. You know how it goes. You take the process description from a client, and design a clean and streamlined work process. Then they look at it and add in heaps of exceptional situations that wreak havoc around your code, force you to do ugly things (hardcoding values anyone?) and make you feel dirty at the end of the day.

 

 

Hardest thing about coding for me is dealing with other web devs.  Best case scenario is they are good but have their own style of doing things..which is mostly okay, as long as they know wtf they are doing.  Worst case scenario (which I should really call average case scenario) is they have no business being a web developer in the first place...client too stingy to put real money into that sort of resource so I'm stuck dealing with c/p cowboys.

You know what, I never used to have a problem with this but it is a pet peeve now. People taking on PHP who don't even like programming or have an interest in developing themselves as decent web developers. You can see it sometimes in the other help forums. Asking questions which they should already know because they've taken on work they can't even understand or want to understand. ugh..I feel dirty.

Implementing business rules. You know how it goes. You take the process description from a client, and design a clean and streamlined work process. Then they look at it and add in heaps of exceptional situations that wreak havoc around your code, force you to do ugly things (hardcoding values anyone?) and make you feel dirty at the end of the day.

 

 

Hardest thing about coding for me is dealing with other web devs.  Best case scenario is they are good but have their own style of doing things..which is mostly okay, as long as they know wtf they are doing.  Worst case scenario (which I should really call average case scenario) is they have no business being a web developer in the first place...client too stingy to put real money into that sort of resource so I'm stuck dealing with c/p cowboys.

 

You know what, I never used to have a problem with this but it is a pet peeve now. People taking on PHP who don't even like programming or have an interest in developing themselves as decent web developers. You can see it sometimes in the other help forums. Asking questions which they should already know because they've taken on work they can't even understand or want to understand. ugh..I feel dirty.

Well, sometimes it isn't their fault.  It's not uncommon for a small time graphic designer, or, hell, even an administrative assistant to be forced to dabble in PHP because their boss wants a small tweak done to their site.  We actually had a few posts like that here a couple months ago.  You can't always tell your boss 'no'.